IRA custodian refuses/ignores repeated requests for rollover
The bulk of my IRA assets are held by a very large custodian which handles retirement plans for university employees. They have ignored my repeated requests over 10 weeks for a partial rollover:first to E Trade, now to Vanguard. I have used written transfer requests, telephone, and a certified letter to them, all with no response. Obviously I am now concerned they are stonewalling because of financial problems.
At this point I want either a complete withdrawal or a 100% rollover. How can I persuade them? Can the IRS be of help? SEC? FINRA?
Permalink Submitted by Al Fry on Sat, 2009-02-14 16:58
You may have better luck going to the new custodian, setting up a shell IRA, signing the transfer paperwork (pretty much standardized and accepted by most everyone), and let them request the transfer. That is the way I have always done it and never had a problem.
Permalink Submitted by Eugene Axelrod on Sat, 2009-02-14 18:24
[quote=”[email protected]“]You may have better luck going to the new custodian, setting up a shell IRA, signing the transfer paperwork (pretty much standardized and accepted by most everyone), and let them request the transfer. That is the way I have always done it and never had a problem.[/quote]
Unfortunately, I have already requested a rollover to an existing E Trade account, using that procedure, and without success. I then set up the Vanguard acct and asked them to request the transfer, Simultaneously I sent a certified letter to TIAA-CREF confirming the Vanguard transfer. That transfer also was rejected. No reasons ever given. Something is going on at TIAA-CREF
Permalink Submitted by Al Fry on Sat, 2009-02-14 18:44
One of their accounts (TIAA or CREF) can only be paid out over a minimum of 9 annual payments. It used to be ten, which meant it could not even be rolled ove. A few years ago, they lowered it to 9.
Permalink Submitted by Eugene Axelrod on Sat, 2009-02-14 19:21
[quote=”[email protected]“]One of their accounts (TIAA or CREF) can only be paid out over a minimum of 9 annual payments. It used to be ten, which meant it could not even be rolled ove. A few years ago, they lowered it to 9.[/quote]
I don’t know about that. The telephone rep who seems very knowledgeable has not mentioned it. I’ll ask him next week
Thanks
Permalink Submitted by Denise Appleby on Sun, 2009-02-15 15:01
[quote=”[email protected]“][quote=”[email protected]“]You may have better luck going to the new custodian, setting up a shell IRA, signing the transfer paperwork (pretty much standardized and accepted by most everyone), and let them request the transfer. That is the way I have always done it and never had a problem.[/quote]
Unfortunately, I have already requested a rollover to an existing E Trade account, using that procedure, and without success. I then set up the Vanguard acct and asked them to request the transfer, Simultaneously I sent a certified letter to TIAA-CREF confirming the Vanguard transfer. That transfer also was rejected. No reasons ever given. Something is going on at TIAA-CREF[/quote]
It seems you want a transfer and not a rollover. Custodians are sticklers for terminology and using the wrong term can result in you transaction being delayed, or processed incorrectly. If you are trying to do a trustee-to-trustee transfer, you may want to use that term only- and make sure that you check/select ‘transfer’ on all the paperwork.
If the transfer is requested as an ACAT transfer- which is usually done when both firms are ACAT eligible, they are required by law to complete the transfer within a few days (I think it is 4), or provide a written explanation to the receiving firm as to why the transfer was not processed. One good reason why Al’s suggested method is the best method to use- it is automated and closely regulated. E-Trade should be able to check their system and tell you the status of the request, and provide an explanation of why the request was not processed.
Exceptions may apply to accounts such as the one mentioned by Al. I am not familiar with those.
Permalink Submitted by Eugene Axelrod on Sun, 2009-02-15 16:03
Thanks for the advice. I checked and the Vanguard form I completed is entitled “Transfer of Assets”. I have no idea whether either Vanguard or TIAA-CREF is ACAT eligible, but will attempt to find out.
In the meantime a brief internet search reveals many complaints about these sorts of problems with TIAA-CREF. I’ve had a few earlier ones myself. Since I am no longer a university employee, the smart thing seems to be to remove all assets from this custodian. Hope I am successful
Permalink Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Sat, 2009-02-21 20:31
TIAA-CREF had a virtual monopoly on university retirement accounts for many years and their staff and practices reflect that. Many universities are now moving away from TIAA-CREF or simply offering other choices in parallel. ANYWAY, whatever funds you have in TIAA have to be set up on a 10-year payout, with a total of 11 installments (one at the time you initiate the process and another at the end of each year for 10 years). You have to complete, have notarized and submit a form to accomplish that. NOTE THAT IF YOU HAVE HAD MULTIPLE INSTITUTIONS contribute to your TIAA account, TIAA-CREF sees these as separate “accounts,” AND YOU HAVE TO COMPLETE A SEPARATE FORM FOR EACH ONE. THis is something I found out about after the fact, TIAA-CREF staff are not likely to volunteer this information, and didn’t discover until the payouts started.
Whatever funds you have in CREF *should* be easier to move out, but I have been told by others – I don’t have first-hand experience with this myself – that TIAA_CREF has made things difficult for people trying to move funds out of the CREF real estate account.
Permalink Submitted by Eugene Axelrod on Sat, 2009-02-21 21:30
I was ultimately successful, through the efforts of a TIAA-CREF representative in Denver, at getting the Vanguard transfer done, and at the (higher) fund prices that prevailed on 2/9/09, the date my certified letter reached them.
Meanwhile further conversations with TIAA reveals that they normally insist on a request made directly to them on their own form, not available online, for transfers out. I am speaking here of traditional IRA accounts, where the bulk of my funds are located. They are specifically in the “Traditional” account, a guaranteed (as much as anything can be, of course) account, currently paying 5.25% on most of my funds. At the time last year that I set this up TIAA assured me these funds could be removed in any amount and with no delay, and they confirm that today by telephone. So I am torn between earning a guaranteed 5.25% until the stock market looks too cheap to ignore, and running the risk that TIAA will at that moment make it difficult/impossible to move funds.
I do however, have a small amount in a traditional TIAA university retirement account, and that is indeed restricted as to withdrawals as Mr Pavlov mentioned. At least that is what they tell me today.
I was in their real estate account for a year or so, but got out a few months ago. The only restrictions were 1)one withdrawal per quarter and 2)all withdrawals by phone, not online.